Cannot Restore Win 2K

[Newbietoo]

Hi,

Sorry, this goes on a bit, but it is pretty serious...

I've spent the best part of a day attempting to recover a Win 2K system. I've tried at least 6 or 7 times (Win 2K re-installs from disk), but have had no success. Thankfully this isn't a "live" situation but a test to see if the process works for when I do need to do it.

Version AIS 2.3.0.279
"Restore to" system (the Target) Dell 650Mhz PIII, 512Kb Memory, 19GB HDD with three Partitions C, D and E

1) Backed up the C Drive of a Win2K system (the Source) that had all Windows updates up until a few months ago. Just one backup (one session) to a Network Drive (accepted all the options to do a "full" OS backup)

2) On the Target, formatted C and D at various stages and did clean installs of Win 2K from the original (Dell) W2K Disk and tried virtually every permutation and combination of "Disaster Recovery" scenarios mentioned on this site e.g:

Clean install on the Target C Drive and then trying to restore over the top with and without MS Recovery Console.

Install Win 2K on Target D, re-format C, restore to C, do the Boot Menu stuff etc to make C the default boot drive...taking a copy of that each time.

In every case when it came to boot the Target from C Drive I get a Blue Screen and an "Inaccessible Boot Device" error.

At boot, both installs show up, however I can only Boot into "D", not the restored C...that happens whether I boot off the Hard Disk or use the Boot Menu disk (floppy) I created with AIS

I have installed Win 2K from the Win2K Disk on C at least 3 times with no problems and can then boot to either C or D i.e. I don't have a Disk problem here

It did say on Restore for it to replace all Duplicate files, however when the restore begins it says it isn't going to replace some files (why would that be, given I'm restoring to a newly formatted partition every time...what "duplicate" files could there be?).

Finally, in desperation, I backed up D (that had just Win 2K and AIS) to E and restored that to C. However at the end of it AIS hung. Most of the Buttons were greyed out. Final commentary in the log was:

From System does not exist: C:\WINNT\sytem32\config\system
To System does not exist: C:\WINNT\sytem32\config\system
To AIS System does not exist: C:\WINNT\sytem32\config\system
Exception: EFCreateError Cannot create file C:\WINNT\AISRecover
To System does not exist: C:\WINNT\sytem32\config\system
Component btnRestore

So that last backup/restore was as basic as you can get install OS to D, Backup to E, restore to C (newly formatted) and it failed.

Over to you

Thanks,
Patrick

[Barry]

The wording of your post leads me to the following question:

Was the source of the backup the same computer - same motherboard and therefore the same on-board disk interface?

AISBackup has been tested many times restoring to the same computer and computers with the same physical attributes, however some low-level hardware interface code within Windows is machine specific - this is set-up when Windows is first installed.

Barry

[Newbietoo]

Hi Barry,

No they're different computers. I can't assume I'll always be able to recover to the same computer; hard disk failure is just one scenario. In fact, based on my own experience that would be least likely. I've had more computers (motherboards) fail than Hard Disks...laptops I've found particularly vulnerable e.g. I've had 3 laptops go U/S on me (all Dell's). In some cases (not all) you can swap the HDD to another system...which case you don't need backup software for.

I'm frankly more concerned about "total loss" e.g. theft, damage or some other misadventure.

Are you saying AIS can't restore to a different computer? That's never come across in any documentation. What would you suggest to cater for those situations?

Thanks
Patrick

[Newbietoo]

...should have mentioned; I do have disk "imaging" software, which is what I would use to transfer from one system to another.

However, that's not the same as disaster recovery, which is what I'm seeking to emulate here. Presumably hardware differences should be an issue for disk images too? For the sake of the exercise, I might just try that

Thanks,
Patrick

[Barry]

Unfortunately the code sections have made this post wider than normal.

I recently had a similar problem when upgrading a motherboard, the problem was the new motherboard used a different chipset and IDE interface, and this causes a BSOD on re-boot. This is not a restore problem; if the restore was to a similar specified PC then the restore would work. I cannot see why disk imaging software would work any differently - except perhaps they are not really disk images and they automatically set-up the correct disk drivers. I would be interested in knowing the answer to that one!

I was able to fix the BSOD problem by using a Microsoft suggestion: Which was to install all disk drivers from which the Operating System will choose the correct one. This involves a registry edit on the restored PC whether using an operating system which works or by making a pre-install environment CD, e.g. BartPE - if you work as a PC technician then a pre-installed environment CD is very useful for booting dead PC’s.

http://www.nu2.nu/pebuilder/

Here is a solution similar to the XP solution I found, but the one specifically mentions 2000 and everything you need is in one zip file, well almost:

http://www.influential-hosting.co.uk/wi ... top-7b.asp

here is some extra information by me:

If the instuctions are followied prior to backup then there are no further considerations, except perhaps to duplicate the registry entries in ControlSet001 and ControlSet002 just in case they are switched when you first boot on the new PC.

The registry edit file is designed to run on the problem computer, if this cannot be booted then you need to load the SYSTEM hive from the problem computer into a registry editor from a working system, using the XP pre-installed environment CD Run REGEDIT, select HKEY_USERS (the root key) and click File / Load Hive and select %systemroot%\system32\config\system and give it a name, e.g. DEADPC. Open the IDEDrivers file in notepad (drag and drop onto notepad) The registry edit file IDEDrivers.reg looks starts like this:

Code: Select all

Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\CriticalDeviceDatabase\primary_ide_channel]
"ClassGUID"="{4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}"
"Service"="atapi"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\CriticalDeviceDatabase\secondary_ide_channel]
"ClassGUID"="{4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}"
"Service"="atapi"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\CriticalDeviceDatabase\*pnp0600]
"ClassGUID"="{4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}"
"Service"="atapi"

[/size]

You can see this will edit HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet on the current system and not the registry hive loaded as DEADPC, so this file must be edited. To replace all references to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet with HKEY_USERS\DEADPC\ControlSet001 run the updated registry editor file and then re-edit ControlSet001 as ControlSet002 as we need the drivers to be installed in both control set entries. (Edit / Replace/ Find: HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet / Replace with: HKEY_USERS\DEADPC\ControlSet001 / Replace All)

After:

Code: Select all

Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

[HKEY_USERS\DEADPC\ControlSet001\Control\CriticalDeviceDatabase\primary_ide_channel]
"ClassGUID"="{4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}"
"Service"="atapi"

[HKEY_USERS\DEADPC\ControlSet001\Control\CriticalDeviceDatabase\secondary_ide_channel]
"ClassGUID"="{4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}"
"Service"="atapi"

[HKEY_USERS\DEADPC\ControlSet001\Control\CriticalDeviceDatabase\*pnp0600]
"ClassGUID"="{4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}"
"Service"="atapi"

[/size]


Confirm that the edit worked, this can be done by ascertaining one of the entries that is missing from the registry now and seeing it there after the edit, for example HKEY_USERS\DEADPC\ControlSet001\Control\CriticalDeviceDatabase\*pnp0600 was not there prior to the edit and was afterwards on the registry I tested this post against.

As the Microsoft article states the other motherboard drivers are also likely to be incorrect, so installing the new motherboard drivers after restore would also be prudent.

After all that, it would probably be easier finding out from the ‘dead’ PC manufacturer the best motherboard replacement.

A bad analogy for the problem is a diesel car does not run on petrol (gasoline), unless you change the engine too.

Please let us know if this works – it may look complicated on paper but is not once you get going. If you have an XP SP2 installation CD the best place to start is by making a pre-installed environment CD.

Barry

[Newbietoo]

Thanks for that Barry,

Yes, I did have the same problem with the Image too. I sought some advice from the Imaging Software folk and the suggestion was to do an "in place upgrade", which worked...search for that on the MS site and you'll get the instructions for the various environments.

Essentially, it's a Repair using the original Win2K install Disks. I'd imagine the same technique would work with XP (BTW I have since downloaded Bart's stuff and made an XP Boot Disk for my XP system, given I didn't get a Disk with that) .

After the W2K Repair, my Apps worked OK, but it does blitz the original Windows (only) Registry settings of course and Internet Explorer so you're back to an "old" version of Windows. Depending on how old your Disk is, you need to go through the update process to get Windows back to where it was.

I thought an AIS Windows Restore over the top of the Repair might fix that, but I wasn't game to tempt fate...would you have any advice on that?

I need to come up with something as I've found I cannot now get Windows Update to work. Fortunately I had a copy of SP4 so could apply that, but there's nothing I can do to get Updating working. I get to the point of having the "Express" or "Custom" update buttons, but clicking either of them doesn't do anything

I've done a fair bit of research and it appears there's a plethora of things that can go wrong with Win Update, but my particular problem wasn't one of the 50 that MS' KB covers! None of the "fixes" I've tried have worked. Most of them point to IE (the "dead" buttons I mention above sounds like a javascript issue, but JS works OK in other contexts, so maybe not).

I suspect the Repair did some damage there, however, even though I've upgraded to a pretty late version of IE via a CD, I still can't make Update work (IE seems OK though as far as I can tell).

I'd appreciate your comments

Thanks,
Patrick

[Barry]

I am pretty sure the option to install all IDE drivers on a system prior to backup will work, however the motherboard driver's disk will have to be re-applied after the first re-boot to update everything else (USB / Chipset / On board sound / on board FireWire / on board Ethernet etc). This solution worked for me and is a lot cleaner than Microsoft's in-place upgrade.

I will try and make the same problem here. Maybe AISBackup can be made to restore to another PC by doing the registry updates and extracting the IDE driver files from the backup itself.

Please try the above suggestion, if that works and the same experiment works here I will initiate the changes within AISBackup as the work involved may take less time than discussing the problem

In return I would like some serious marketing of AISBackup - tell a few local magazines about the problem and 'AISBackup' solution. I am sure this kind of problem must crop up a lot.

If anybody knows of any reason why this is not a good idea then please let us know.

Barry

[Newbietoo]

If all else fails, here's a site that offers an alternative to Windows Update:

http://www.windizupdate.com

...it works with Firefox, Opera et al

Updates are downloading as I write this...hope they install OK!!

Patrick

[Newbietoo]

humph...not sure where I go to for the motherboard drivers

However if you can address this issue with AIS that would be great. As for marketing AIS; I do believe my own modest efforts have borne you some fruit; I know of at least one license and I'm sure their must be others...I have told a lot of people!

Patrick

[Barry]

Most motherboard manufactures post the drivers on their web site. I have not been to Dell for a few years but last time I looked you could download the relevant drivers (this was based on model number - and included their old PC's). Dell used to send out their PC's with driver disc's, however, of late, Compaq, Dell etc seem to be creating on disk boot 'repair' partitions, all very well, unless the hard drive fails. This is not too bad if you have a backup and can se one of the many ways to restore with AISBackup - that is unless you are changing PC's - which is the point of this post.

Thank you for the referrals!

Barry